Top 12~Sink or Swim?

Maddog Fox

Guest
Killa said it all. There be sharks on the rim and Vigil is chum in the water.

I give them 4 weeks and they will break under their own dead weight
 

CrankyOldMan

Guest
In Eta the Union 10-15 million at the time had to fight a 2 million point alliance for a couple months not because The Union is laughable but because the 2 million point alliance were masters at the art of defence they had one player Kings-of-Kings who had less than 1k abp and nearly a million dbp. I can name a few other situations where if your experienced enough you can just use your troops to snipe CS's only and barely anyone could take cities from you.

This game favors defense ... to be called defensively great is when you stop attack after attack with the min. def possible and what you describe here this person was more of a stacker, DBP alone is not the measurement of a good defensive alliance. There is no way that a solid 15 million point alliance should take that long to wrap up a 2 million pt alliance even if it was totally turtled ... The number of Cities that the 15 million alliance has would crush that alliance in a few weeks at most. Even if the alliance was on a remote border resource transfers to the front would mean the 15 million alliance could re build faster than the 2 million alliance and would quickly win by attrition.

If the 15 million alliance was mine to lead I would be ashamed and ask that I be removed from leadership.
 

CLINTAURUS

Peltast
Im just glad evil finally gave ol mercs some kudos...lol... Thank you sir... And by the way it looks like infection might be getting a bail out... Or kinda... Wte has now crumbled and restructured as contagious, which im guessing is a dummy academy of infection....lol... All very laughable... Since most of them are inactive.... I guess at least they found a way to gain more points and a higher rank while they are sinking... Like i said... Points are secondary.... Look at the intel... That will tell you the story.....
 

Portopolis

Taxiarch
Some of your guys play on the Union just a head's up. They where fighting multiple wars at the time so not everyone was focused on attacking the 2 million point alliance. The Union actually went around their ocean and then decimated the 3rd placed alliance and I think at the time the Union was around 6-9 million points not 10-15 It was a long time since I played that world so I got the size mixed up.
 

Mayor Fawkes

Newcomer
Mac: the (actually 36-hour) ceasefire for diplomatic talks with the PG was not the best one, admittedly, as they were allowed the opportunity to show their true colors of treachery yet again. I always myself doubted that they were really considering a merge, given their previous history of betrayal and slick maneuvering. Yet make no mistake: they are paying for their decision-making, and will continue to in the upcoming days. Their decisions have left no room for any kind of mercy.
Sorry I'm late to the party, but I find this very funny. Each time we asked for the ceasefire, we gave it full consideration. We brought it to all the members to vote on and all the members voted no. And talking about treachery, your leadership only wanted our 6-8 best members. We were not going to leave the rest of them behind. We have more loyalty to our members than that.

And red, you are still considered a joke to us here in Phoenix. When you say you have 20k bir in your harbor, yeah we know you are lying.
 

Phaedo of Byblos

Guest
Ummm...do you want to talk about how all of the leaders moved to the Bilderberg Groupies (sister alliance) and created a concentration camp of sorts with the main alliance (made up mainly of former FEA members), with the intention of dividing the main alliance amongst themselves and Showtime? Maybe a little chat about how you all stated in chats that we all knew what was going on when we had no idea? Sending random messages about "inactivity," etc. is not informing us of plans to betray an entire half of your alliance. A PG leader should not be talking about loyalty; you are all about saving your own skins and preserving the integrity of your leadership positions.

You brought the decision to all of the PG members in a voting-type scenario? Doubtful. But I stand corrected if that is truly the case.

You guys lie and/or distort the truth all of the time. There are so many examples of (now) Phoenix Group leadership doing this. Don't think that it goes unnoticed.
 

Mac Bolan

Peltast
Well if i knew my top 12 was going start such a stir I would have done it sooner. Maybe if my top 12 stirs this much a top 13 would stir up even more? ;)
 

Mayor Fawkes

Newcomer
Ummm...do you want to talk about how all of the leaders moved to the Bilderberg Groupies (sister alliance) and created a concentration camp of sorts with the main alliance (made up mainly of former FEA members), with the intention of dividing the main alliance amongst themselves and Showtime? Maybe a little chat about how you all stated in chats that we all knew what was going on when we had no idea? Sending random messages about "inactivity," etc. is not informing us of plans to betray an entire half of your alliance. A PG leader should not be talking about loyalty; you are all about saving your own skins and preserving the integrity of your leadership positions.

You brought the decision to all of the PG members in a voting-type scenario? Doubtful. But I stand corrected if that is truly the case.

You guys lie and/or distort the truth all of the time. There are so many examples of (now) Phoenix Group leadership doing this. Don't think that it goes unnoticed.
Actually we never wanted any of the FEA members in the group, especially you and Jimmy as you both were untrustworthy to begin with. That was all Codebug's decision. He was the one who brought you guys in and started the mess in O43. Showtime didn't trust you guys either, which is why we split into the Groupies. That was one of the main condition that the former Showtime leadership had with us was to get rid of most of the FEA members. The main core of TRUSTWORTHY ex-Bilderberg members were moved over. You are just mad because we didn't trust you. Maybe you should've proved to us we could trust you.

We never considered the most of the former FEA members to be a part of the alliance, so when the time came, we chose not to bring you in. After you guys left, we chose additional leaders, and got rid of some. We were looking for loyalty and knew most of the FEA members weren't loyal to us. We asked you to prove it and you didn't. So it's your own fault you weren't a part of the group.

Now we bring everything to the members and ask their opinions because we trust them
 

Phaedo of Byblos

Guest
Actually we never wanted any of the FEA members in the group, especially you and Jimmy as you both were untrustworthy to begin with. That was all Codebug's decision. He was the one who brought you guys in and started the mess in O43. Showtime didn't trust you guys either, which is why we split into the Groupies. That was one of the main condition that the former Showtime leadership had with us was to get rid of most of the FEA members. The main core of TRUSTWORTHY ex-Bilderberg members were moved over. You are just mad because we didn't trust you. Maybe you should've proved to us we could trust you.

We never considered the most of the former FEA members to be a part of the alliance, so when the time came, we chose not to bring you in. After you guys left, we chose additional leaders, and got rid of some. We were looking for loyalty and knew most of the FEA members weren't loyal to us. We asked you to prove it and you didn't. So it's your own fault you weren't a part of the group.

Now we bring everything to the members and ask their opinions because we trust them
I did nothing but to try to prove my trustworthiness to the BG leaders. I don't know what you're talking about, but Jimmy and I did nothing to not be trusted. In fact, none of the former FEA members did anything to not be trusted. You have not stated one reason why the FEA could not be trusted. The only thing that you can possibly say would be the diplomatic relations that we had with both LoUG and The BG, something that was explained in full to CodeBug. In fact, you guys wouldn't have even known about it had Jimmy not told you immediately upon him joining the BG. You split from Groupies and were deciding to betray former FEA members because you were all scared of Showtime (as Showtime was upset due to them considering some former FEA members that were newly accepted into the BG as refugees) and were trying to appease them. You can't distort the truth--I remember everything, and will post more details if you keep on trying to justify your treachery.

Thus, the distrust of former FEA was based upon an unfounded paranoia. And if Showtime didn't trust us, why did they accept us? Jimmy and I moved over to Showtime once we found out what you guys were up to. Do you have more lies that you'd like me to demolish? This is fun :-D
 

Phaedo of Byblos

Guest
Furthermore: we joined the BG because of problems with FEA leadership, not during any type of war or conflict with you all (something else that you all lied about to Showtime--FEA members joined the BG due to an impetus made from within, not because we were losing a conflict with the BG, a conflict that never existed). You need to give it up and admit what you all did. Just lies upon lies coming from you and most of the BG leaders.

Also, you are "trusting your members" now because you know that you guys are finished. Decisions made out of necessity can sometimes be too late, I suppose. And, once again, I seriously doubt that you all put up the latest major decision to an alliance-wide vote. It was most likely a decision made by 3-4 of you. Admitting your faults is the shortest route to resolving them.
 
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Mayor Fawkes

Newcomer
You must be a person who thinks he is always right because a lot of what you say is misinformed. We know why FEA joined BG, and we understood that it was due to your poor leadership. And I never told Showtime that you joined because you were losing a conflict. That was all Codebug, but if it was me that made them think that, then I am sorry for that.

And no all of our decisions are alliance based. The leaders give their own opinions, but if the alliance doesn't like it, we won't do it. So if you really think we try to save our own skins, you are gravely mistaken. If that was the case, then we would've merged with Showtime when Codebug screwed us, or would've of merged with LoUG more recently. I always admit any faults that I have, and apologize when I have made a fault, but have I apologized no. Even if I don't tell everybody everything; all that I do tell is honest. So you know what, I am sorry for not telling you everything, but you didn't deserve to be told everything.
 
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Portopolis

Taxiarch
1. Mamluk Nation-Swim based in 65 moved into 64 mostly They are the biggest and even their academy/sister is a very solid alliance.
2. The Silent Force-Swim based in 56 and 55 moved into 46 They are expanding quickly into the 46 area.
3. Maniacal Destiny-Swim/Float based in 45 and 55 moved into 44 Expanding quickly into 44 against Infection.
4. Infection-Float/Swim based in 54 and 44 moved into 45/55 and mostly around the center of the world They are at war with at least 2 of the Top 7 alliances.
5. Vigilate-Swim Based in 34 moved into 24,35,45 and 44. At War with BCC.
6. Mercenaries- Swim/Float Based in 55 moved into 45 and 54, At war with infection stable growth.
7. League of Ugly Gentlemen- Swim Based in 44 moved into 43/53/42/32 Everyone seems to say they are MRAish and will sink but who is honestly fighting them. At war with TPG?
8. Knights of The Republic- My alliance based in 66 moved into 67/76, no other comment.
9. Vigilate 2- Swim Based in 24 and 34. See Vigilate for the rest.
10. Mamluk Askari- Swim Based in 75 moved into 74/65/64.
11. Rex Autem Mundi- Floating Based in 46 moved into 47/35. Getting hit by TSF and NWO.
12. League of Exiled-Swim Based in 44 invited players in 42 so has a large hole in the map in 43. See LoUG
 

Phaedo of Byblos

Guest
You must be a person who thinks he is always right because a lot of what you say is misinformed. We know why FEA joined BG, and we understood that it was due to your poor leadership. And I never told Showtime that you joined because you were losing a conflict. That was all Codebug, but if it was me that made them think that, then I am sorry for that.

And no all of our decisions are alliance based. The leaders give their own opinions, but if the alliance doesn't like it, we won't do it. So if you really think we try to save our own skins, you are gravely mistaken. If that was the case, then we would've merged with Showtime when Codebug screwed us, or would've of merged with LoUG more recently. I always admit any faults that I have, and apologize when I have made a fault, but have I apologized no. Even if I don't tell everybody everything; all that I do tell is honest. So you know what, I am sorry for not telling you everything, but you didn't deserve to be told everything.
Note to you: you just validated everything that I said before. And I don't have to justify what happened at FEA: you can ask former FEA members yourself about my de-facto leadership and the real reasons why I (me) chose to leave there. You are distorting the truth; you know exactly what happened, yet you are trying to make it seem like I was a bad leader there. FEA disbanded because I didn't want to be part of the power struggle anymore--and once I left, things started to unravel. That is not the trappings of a bad leader, though of course I did make mistakes, just like anyone else does.

If CodeBug was the one that told them that, it doesn't matter; you clearly didn't try to influence him not to give false information. Besides, as leaders you all should take responsibility for what happened--or, at the very least, don't make it seem as if you have no idea what I'm talking about and that I'm misinformed. Do I know everything? Of course I don't. But I know enough to know that the BG leadership, including you, tried to screw us over for no reason. I'm very informed, and you are just having a difficult time admitting that you were part of a leadership that made unfair and serpentine decisions.

As far as me not "deserving" to know everything, I never expected to know anything beyond what I was entitled to. As a non-leader at the BG, I accepted the way things were run--e.g., you all always keeping everyone in the dark until the very last minute. However, I think that the members that you all concentrated (including me) in the main alliance, with the intent to disband it, should have been made known. That much, I think, we all "deserved" to know.

No apologies or acknowledgment is expected from you--I would be giving you too much credit to assume that you were capable of such things after what you participated in. It is enough for me to know that I'm putting this out for everyone to see, so that anyone has a second guess before really trusting you. You are the one that is not and was never worthy of trust, not me, nor are any of the fiercely loyal and former FEA members that you all decided to abandon for no reason whatsoever.

The decisions that you all made were horrible, undeserved, and just plain non-strategic. That, dear Fawkes, is "bad leadership."
 

Mac Bolan

Peltast
0ooo! Mayor and Phaedo Lamia has a trash talk thread which has sadly been neglected. I would love to see you hash out this debate there. Bringing life back into a dying thread. Unless you both want to try making a top 12 of your own? I think once you get there we can give you pistols at twenty paces.
 

Phaedo of Byblos

Guest
0ooo! Mayor and Phaedo Lamia has a trash talk thread which has sadly been neglected. I would love to see you hash out this debate there. Bringing life back into a dying thread. Unless you both want to try making a top 12 of your own? I think once you get there we can give you pistols at twenty paces.
Haha, the Trash Talk thread would probably be a better place for this. I'm dying over how real this got lol. See what you've conjured, Mac? (You would :-D)

And it's fine--I don't do pistols, Mac. Only hugs and slingers :D
 

Mayor Fawkes

Newcomer
Debate is pointless. We both seem to have information that isn't known to the other. Yes we could've done things different in the past, but that's where I'm going to leave this, in the past. All I want is to play the game, and be with those who are respectable. I could say more and let you continue to twist my words and past actions, but I'm wiping my hands of this and taking myself out of the position to look bad.

I don't need to trash talk to make myself feel better or look good. I have respect for some players in LoUG and those I don't have respect for, I will still try to be respectful. Say whatever you want to this, I'm done.
 

Phaedo of Byblos

Guest
Despite what was said in response to Mac, what I posted wasn't Trash Talk, nor was it an ego thing for me. It was simply stating the truth of what really happened. You were never disrespected. Your words were not twisted. I backed up whatever I said with hard facts.

It did feel good to get the truth out there, of course--but, primarily, it was the (perhaps misplaced) medium to let you know that I (and many others) do not appreciate the decisions that you took part in and helped support. It was also, in part, to warn others against putting their trust in you and others that took part in that decision-making process without you proving that you have at least the capacity not to betray fellow alliance members that are undeserving of betrayal. I respect everyone, even when they do obnoxious things, because of the knowledge that Karma is a hard and unrelenting b.

I'm done with this as well. Let's move on.
 

party1234

Artisan
1. Mamluk Nation-Swim based in 65 moved into 64 mostly They are the biggest and even their academy/sister is a very solid alliance.
2. The Silent Force-Swim based in 56 and 55 moved into 46 They are expanding quickly into the 46 area.
3. Maniacal Destiny-Swim/Float based in 45 and 55 moved into 44 Expanding quickly into 44 against Infection.
4. Infection-Float/Swim based in 54 and 44 moved into 45/55 and mostly around the center of the world They are at war with at least 2 of the Top 7 alliances.
5. Vigilate-Swim Based in 34 moved into 24,35,45 and 44. At War with BCC.
6. Mercenaries- Swim/Float Based in 55 moved into 45 and 54, At war with infection stable growth.
7. League of Ugly Gentlemen- Swim Based in 44 moved into 43/53/42/32 Everyone seems to say they are MRAish and will sink but who is honestly fighting them. At war with TPG?
8. Knights of The Republic- My alliance based in 66 moved into 67/76, no other comment.
9. Vigilate 2- Swim Based in 24 and 34. See Vigilate for the rest.
10. Mamluk Askari- Swim Based in 75 moved into 74/65/64.
11. Rex Autem Mundi- Floating Based in 46 moved into 47/35. Getting hit by TSF and NWO.
12. League of Exiled-Swim Based in 44 invited players in 42 so has a large hole in the map in 43. See LoUG
Good list- except #5. Clearly a sinking ship. They aren't moving into 35.
 

Redthegreat

Guest
Ya I'm not going to say names but five of the top 12 are working very close together to get md and vig the hell out here they got boring time to just steam roll there weak defense
 

Maddog Fox

Guest
Commenting further on #5 in that latest top 12. To call it "war" with BCC is a bit of an overstatement wouldn't you say? I mean is an ant at war with a boot? Is a seal at war with an Orca? I think not...

Sure they are bigger - that just means more targets for us.