Reset during World Wonders

rclay321

Lochagos
A software bug is an error, flaw, failure or fault in a computer program or system that causes it to produce an incorrect or unexpected result, or to behave in unintended ways.

By definition, it is a bug.
Explain to me how it produces an unexpected or incorrect result? Seems it worked just as intended. I do think resetting your account should not be allowed once a world is closed to new players, however he did nothing wrong since it is allowed currently
 
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K9Jena

Newcomer
What we're talking about is not resetting - its quitting, especially after wonders start. Its quitting for the purpose of achieving morale. Playing around the rules is not the same as playing within the rules. Let's call it what it is.
 

dethmatic

Peltast
they didn't punish people for using the vm mode on wonders what makes you people think that there will be punishment handed down for taking advantage of resetting for morale boosts? seriously? it is what it is, it will not change. is it fair? heck no. but, like i stated in last post, the developers do not care, if you actually want a resolution post about it on the EN forums. they actually have mods there that actually give a hoot and would forward it on. these US forums are a joke. just a piece of advise there.
 

Pluto

Citizen
they didn't punish people for using the vm mode on wonders what makes you people think that there will be punishment handed down for taking advantage of resetting for morale boosts? seriously? it is what it is, it will not change. is it fair? heck no. but, like i stated in last post, the developers do not care, if you actually want a resolution post about it on the EN forums. they actually have mods there that actually give a hoot and would forward it on. these US forums are a joke. just a piece of advise there.
Contrary to your belief these threads are monitored just the same as any other market forums.

You are welcome to voice your opinions, but please keep them constructive and polite
 

rclay321

Lochagos
What we're talking about is not resetting - its quitting, especially after wonders start. Its quitting for the purpose of achieving morale. Playing around the rules is not the same as playing within the rules. Let's call it what it is.
But it is allowed so it is within the rules, sorry but just cause you get burned by something doesn't mean its automatically cheating. Everyone always says this is a war game, but in truth it is a strategy game and his strategy worked for him. It is a bit unethical but legal. Until it is changed then it is fair play. That's what it really is
 

DeletedUser10354

Guest
What we're talking about is not resetting - its quitting, especially after wonders start. Its quitting for the purpose of achieving morale. Playing around the rules is not the same as playing within the rules. Let's call it what it is.

There are two buttons in grepolis. One is resetting the other is delete. Resetting is exactly what is says it is...it resets your account. Delete is quitting a world. If Inno intended them to both be one and the same then they wouldn't have created two different buttons to achieve two different results.
 

DeletedUser10354

Guest
But it is allowed so it is within the rules, sorry but just cause you get burned by something doesn't mean its automatically cheating. Everyone always says this is a war game, but in truth it is a strategy game and his strategy worked for him. It is a bit unethical but legal. Until it is changed then it is fair play. That's what it really is
What makes it unethical? If Grep didn't want you to be able to use morale as a tool then they wouldn't create worlds with morale as an optional rule. If you don't like people using morale then don't join a world with morale enabled. No one forced anyone to join Baris...a morale world. No one forces anyone to stay in Baris if you don't like the settings.
 

dethmatic

Peltast
Contrary to your belief these threads are monitored just the same as any other market forums.

You are welcome to voice your opinions, but please keep them constructive and polite
no offense pluto, but these forums and mods that actually reply are by no means can compare to the community on the en forums, and my point taken you take the time to make a post and a reply to me but nothing in regards to the issue being addressed in this thread.... kinda proves my point there
 

rclay321

Lochagos
It is unethical, if you had it done against you you would see otherwise. Taking yourself from 100 cities down to only a handful just to protect your wonders is a bit unethical and should be fixed by not allowing someone to reset once no other players are allowed to join the world. As for the morale, I am all for removing morale on wonder cities or even uping the minimum to 80% on those islands. But until those rules are changed, this tactic is legal. It's just cheap
 

DeletedUser10354

Guest
I agree with Ever Ready.

Please consider changing the rules where a player who ghosts and re-sets cannot re-enter the world. If they are allowed to re-enter, then they should not be allowed to be a world wonder player. Otherwise, this will be a new tactic used to stall wonders in all worlds. Right now, new players cannot join at a certain point and this should be the same rule for players who reset.

And, please consider changing morale for WW players to 100% morale, once they join an active WW. We're also seeing alliances "downsize" players so they can simply take advantage of the low morale issue.

These schemes may also encourage multi-accounting, as all a player has to do reset or downsize, take wonders, get stacked by alliance and not play very much the rest of the world, unless attacked.

These stratagems adversely impact the intent of the game and prolong the end game.
Whitty you are incorrect in your statement above as not all worlds have morale enabled, thus this is not a tactic that will be used in all worlds. I assume that is because Inno doesn't want players to be able to use morale as a tool in some worlds so maybe you should consider that when deciding which worlds you want to play in in the future. Personally I would prefer this as it puts an artificial timeline on a world and doesnt allow it to drag on forever.

After a year and a half accounts get bloated with 200+ cities then and only then does morale really become an issue against a player like mike with what...8-9 cities? If I play grep again it would only be in a morale world so that this tactic can effectively end a world after a certain point.
 

DeletedUser10354

Guest
It is unethical, if you had it done against you you would see otherwise. Taking yourself from 100 cities down to only a handful just to protect your wonders is a bit unethical and should be fixed by not allowing someone to reset once no other players are allowed to join the world. As for the morale, I am all for removing morale on wonder cities or even uping the minimum to 80% on those islands. But until those rules are changed, this tactic is legal. It's just cheap
The rules don't need changing - there are worlds with morale and those without morale. If you don't want someone to use the tactic against you then don't play in a morale world. As for it being cheap there are lots of things in grepo that are "cheap". You can pact the world and try and win by outnumbering an opponent 10 to 1. There is no skill in that and it's cheap but you can still do it. You can also buy endless units and endless cities with gold. While that tactic is not cheap on the wallet it is certainly a cheap tactic.

As I posted above I like morale because it effectively puts an artificial timeline on a world. If you don't like morale and want to be able to play in a world forever then there are worlds where you can do that!
 

rva98

Newcomer
I rarely post on the forums, but relative to the Baris morale/reset/WW issue, the way I see it a reset is the functional equivalent of a new player joining a world during WWs. That is not permitted, for the very reason that a new player could be planted on a WW and thus all the defense directed to his town(s) will enjoy the moral bonus. With the reset of the player, you get the same thing, complete with beginner's protection and the whole deal.

It's no real surprise that we have to discuss this, considering the people involved in doing it. Duck and Oli keep insisting that the world was "won" a year ago, but it that were the case, they didn't win it - that would have been Kittens, as I recall. But the fact is that more than one alliance can "win" in the sense of getting certificates for 4 WWs. No one has made it to 7, and it is just ego and denial on their part after so much switching and handing off of WWs and all that.

In any event, a reset is the same as a new player being introduced late. It's not a loophole or a glitch. It's just illegal. Shame on the players who did it.
 

DeletedUser10354

Guest
Baris is the world- we are about to take the 7th WW when Mike.22mba resets and starts in protection mode. He builds quickly and his team begins flipping the WW cities to him so they are protected in beginners mode and can have the benefit of moral. He is low in points now so has moral playing on his side.

This is an unfair advantage- Grepolis stopped Vacation mode in WW due to people taking advantage of the game rules. This is a worse loop hole than the VM.

Gives them protection in WW cities during beginners protection
Allows them to rebuild and stack the cities
Allows a very low moral player to have an unfair advantage in protecting the WW's.

Please address ASAP this world has gone on forever and it's time for a fair winner!

Also Ever Ready your statement confused me. How were you about to take the 7th WW? You couldn't even get a revolt on the 7th WW when it was at 100% morale. How can you take a wonder without even getting a revolt. I know you are advocating for rules to be changed mid-game here so are you also advocating that cities in a revolt world be allowed to be taken without even achieving a revolt?
 

DeletedUser10354

Guest
I rarely post on the forums, but relative to the Baris morale/reset/WW issue, the way I see it a reset is the functional equivalent of a new player joining a world during WWs. That is not permitted, for the very reason that a new player could be planted on a WW and thus all the defense directed to his town(s) will enjoy the moral bonus. With the reset of the player, you get the same thing, complete with beginner's protection and the whole deal.

It's no real surprise that we have to discuss this, considering the people involved in doing it. Duck and Oli keep insisting that the world was "won" a year ago, but it that were the case, they didn't win it - that would have been Kittens, as I recall. But the fact is that more than one alliance can "win" in the sense of getting certificates for 4 WWs. No one has made it to 7, and it is just ego and denial on their part after so much switching and handing off of WWs and all that.

In any event, a reset is the same as a new player being introduced late. It's not a loophole or a glitch. It's just illegal. Shame on the players who did it.

RVA - two questions for you.

1- If the world was not "won" then why did I get a certificate and badge that says "Victor of Baris"? If that badge is not earned for winning the world can you please advise your definition of the word victor please?

2- If it is "illegal" for a player to reset then why does Inno allow you to do it? It is illegal to share resources or support a player with which you share a connection so that is not allowed by the game. It's illegal to attack with 5 CSs so the game does not allow you to do that either. There are many things that are illegal that the game doesn't allow you to do...If Inno intended for a restart to be the same as delete then they would have made the two buttons do the exact same thing. They don't because they are two completely different actions.
 

Mazda6

Philosopher
I noticed duck has made like 20 posts, does each post count as a vote to keep the rules the same? should i make 20 posts per thread as well?
 

red herron

Newcomer
Don't say much in this forum, but have to say that this tactic of resetting to purposely drop morale on WW cities to greatly increase the difficulty of attacking them is a pretty cheap shot. Brings to mind the NFL "snowplow game" in 1982 where, in the final minutes of a scoreless game being played during a heavy snowfall, the home team sent out a snowplow to clear an area of the field specifically so that they could cleanly kick a ball to score a field goal and win. Yes, the move was "legal", but it was clearly not in the spirit of the game and demonstrated legendarily poor sportsmanship. The result of the game was not overturned, but the following year, the NFL banned the use of snowplows on the field during a game.

You can call this move, or the move of resetting specifically to create a massive morale advantage "crafty", or smart strategy. But, in the end, these kinds of tactics cheapen the game. If Inno felt that popping VM as a wonders defense was a sleazy tactic that served only to delay or circumvent normal fair play, then this reset thing has to be seen as even worse. If the moderators and game creators do not agree, then why not just rescind the new VM guidelines for wonders, do away with the 72 hour alliance-hopping rule, and allow new players to join worlds at anytime? Seriously, if you are trying to even the playing field during wonders, and shaping the game so that the alliances which have built wonders have to face each other without cheap tricks, then this reset thing has got to go. If you let it continue, then you are abrogating your responsibility as moderators to the players who have invested significant amounts of time (and MONEY, as you are well aware) in the game.

Oh, and a footnote to those of you who are applauding your own cleverness for employing the reset tactic... the team that lost due to the deployment of the snowplow later eliminated the same opponent in the playoffs and went on to play in the Superbowl. But the reputation for poor sportsmanship persists to this day.
 

subhasis87

Newcomer
Explain to me how it produces an unexpected or incorrect result? Seems it worked just as intended. I do think resetting your account should not be allowed once a world is closed to new players, however he did nothing wrong since it is allowed currently

The fact that the players launched at a city with 100% morale and hit it with 30% morale even though the city was under beginner protection after it got flipped is a bit unexpected/incorrect, don't you think. There were no options to recall the attacks or let the attacks just bounce.
 

Oliver Clothesoff

Hekatonarch
Omg can I not retire in peace?

I'd say my ears are ringing but man reading through this (and seeing some of the people willing to get on here to FINALLY post).. it certainly makes something ring.


Full assessment of the issue:

Restarting to get a player on wonders IS a low move.. it is against what this game USED to stand for. But come on people.. glass houses.. This is not against the rules. It is not botting or a bug. That doesnt make it right, but people shouldnt be "punished" The rules need to be changed just like the VM aspect. The issue really is the fact that the player received Beginners Protection for restarting. Morale is not the issue. You all chose to be in a world that had morale active. You did this knowingly. So to cry because it is used in the end game is a moot point. What the the group should have done instead of restarting was have the player hand off all their cities and then take just the wonders. No BP, and low morale strategy put to use. It takes longer sure but the desired result is achieved. That shouldnt be removed when the world has morale active.But change the rules and institute them after the fact.. dont just make the players reverse what was done as a way to cover up a new strategy.. thats poor modding and not really obtaining a true solution.

Now to address everyone on here crying over a strategy being used because it affects them directly. Get over it. This game went off a ledge a long time ago. Everyone in here has benefited from at least one of what can be considered "low moves". Did you not all read my lovely goodbye message.

If you have ever done one of the following, you have absolutely NO standing to complain:
- Multi-accounting
- Botting
- Using the Mods as a weapon (i.e. reporting a player who has not really violated the rules in hopes that by spamming the mods you will get him banned so you can attack)
- Teaming up with 80% of the world in order to win
- Rotating alliances so that mass groups can all get a crown

These are all downfalls of this game.

And as a final thought.. everyone here complaining about players restarting and using low morale... Please Refresh my memory.. didnt you use that exact strategy to initially get set up near Koopa wonders like 6 months ago? Forget the fact that it may or may not have been a second account.. but you place a low morale player in 74, they would found, take ghosts, or even inactives.. grow them, and then hand them off to bigger players once secure. On occasion those cities also had BP on them.. Where is the difference?

Oh thats right.. the only difference is that you were doing it then so its ok.. Oh.. that AND we werent petty and didnt report you for it...

So get over it.. Baris needs to close anyway.. but dont act like you earned anything. The debate over Victor vs. Crown is as old as the wonder stage and is off topic to this thread.. You always want to debate on the side that effects you. Only 1 alliance can get victor.. and an unlimited amount of players can get a crown. There is no debating that.

Thats why we cant get along or have nice things.. Everyone in here needs to look in the mirror.. being honest with yourself isnt really that hard..

Love,

Oli
 
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