D&D: Spying

DeletedUser

Guest
Darth Nihilus. said:
I agree it makes you "stronger" but not in the sense of you're actually a good leader/alliance/player. Stronger as in just harder to defeat (and there's always ways around that). I'm saying it makes you weaker, because now you're relying on a person who you may or may not know well to feed you info. That player has to be on at critical times and/or all the time, and feed you the RIGHT information. Second point is, if the spy is willing to spy on their current alliance for an enemy, what stops him (if there is no mutual friendship anywhere throughout your alliance) from doing the same to you should he/she join you?
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I don't need to rely on my spy. My spy is for when that player is offline, that trip got triggered, and we've got a HC 20 minutes out but knowing right that second if there's a CS there could save 5 LS nukes.

I don't place too much importance on what they tell me for reasons you said. But how hard do you think it is to catch someone lying to you, giving you false information? It's a lot easier than catching a spy in your own alliance.



The part about them joining is the most valid argument anyone can give against spies, and the hardest one to argue with. Typically, I decide if a spy can join my alliance based on the motive they had for spying in the first place. If it was something like they were afraid of being conquered, no, they are not allowed to join. If it was because they had a friend in my alliance, maybe. You just have to make a decision, are you willing to take that chance? I've got a few different strategies for catching spies, so usually I am (if it's a good player).


Please note, once again, MY opinions, not my ALLIANCE's.
 
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DeletedUser11717

Guest
Fair enough and I agree with the majority of what you said there. I'm the same way with spies joining, it's on condition of their motive.
 

DeletedUser12720

Guest
I hate spy, but in the end spies often win wars, most of the top alliance use them. (At least in en)
 

DeletedUser12001

Guest
wtbuff said:
Look mate its clear you would like to argue with your combative style, but then again that all you Inked up guys seem to do! On almost every single post you see one or two from Inked up arguing with someone. We get it guys you are the best and will rim us all for disagreeing with you, you guys enjoy a good fight blah blah blah but that doesn't mean you guys have to be such arses sometime. No need to hype yourselfs up because we can all see your roster and see the other possibles. Just because your suppose to be the "best" doesn't mean you need to display yourselves this way have some respect for the noobs like myself ;)
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I always like premades with the "we will accept no pacts" mentality. Because then its just watching to see when their first paxt comes, rather than if.
 

DeletedUser4951

Guest
I think that's more of a "don't bug us" thing than a serious thing. Seriously having run premades, the last thing I want to deal with is people asking us for pacts, merges, NAPs, before BP even ends.
 

DeletedUser

Guest
With Apraxxidaddy being in this server there will be alot of drama and spying right off the bat he prob already has spies somehow in like 9 allliances haha. and dont forget about the lapdog meridian
 

DeletedUser6919

Guest
The Smilodon Fatalis said:
Is the act of soliciting a player to pass along information spying fair game or is it a dirty move? What if that player approaches you? Is it wrong to accept?
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Depends on your definition of spying and what type of info we're talking about.

I am a shamelss gossip so often find out things that happen behind closed doors in other alliances but I don't see that the same as using spies. It's nothing like getting info on who has cities claimed and CS arrival times. In many cases the stuff I find out aren't secrets anyways, I just find out sooner than they happen but it's nothing hidden as such. So things like merges being agreed and pacts being desolved, everyone will find out anyways so it's not an issue if I find out a bit sooner but occasionally it gives a bit of heads up. If its something that will effect diplomacy for my alliance so like knowing sooner.

Being honest trying to find out something useful isn't the reason I gossip tho. I admit I do it 'cos I find it entertaining. I love getting copies of some folks fights. Watching people bicker other nonesence is hilarious. Seeing drama llamas fighting over auths and voting over who is in charge always makes me smile.

However as much as I like watching internal drama unfold in other alliances I would never plant a spy. I may make jokes about using or being one, but I think it'd ruin the game for me. If i knew who had my (and my team mates) cities claimed, when CS were going to be sent, who in enemy alliance was going offline and not able to respond to alarm, I'd be super bored.

As for people offering info, if someone approaches me with info so they can save their city(s) or for other ridiculous reason, then I forward info onto alliance founder/leader or if it's info about claims, I also message the player who has res on city, so they know there is no point trying for it. So I do use the info provide as it would be crazy not too but turn the guy/gal in.

Not for any just and ethical reasons, it's just good sense. I find that having a good relationshp with other alliances will get me more benefit than taking info off a poor player that will no doubt ghost in a few weeks anyways. I would never consider inviting them or trust working with them, so I see very little reason to interact with traitors.

The first time I ever spoke to the grepo love of my life Darko was when I forwarded a message to him from someone in his alliance handing over claim info. The only reason that I'm playing on US servers now is that I joined Sigma with TBC, I got talking to them back on Lindos (EN) when I handed spy over so I got to know Fugly and co then and I see those guys as family, so I have had a lot of good come out of turning rats over.

However if I know someone has a spy in my camp or someone was handing over info for good reasons, then that is a different story.

tl;dr spies are bad, gossiping good
 
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DeletedUser4951

Guest
Most the time when I get info I either do a MM to the team or I strike up a conversation and it just comes out. My favorite phrase is "you're nothing like I thought". :D
 

DeletedUser11827

Guest
This is a war game. Spies are part of war. If you choose to handicap yourself and your alliance by not using them, that's your choice. But you can bet I'm gonna be looking at copies of your forums all the while that you are busy preserving your integrity.
 

DeletedUser

Guest
Hack Rancid said:
This is a war game. Spies are part of war. If you choose to handicap yourself and your alliance by not using them, that's your choice. But you can bet I'm gonna be looking at copies of your forums all the while that you are busy preserving your integrity.
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True, so many alliances use them that if you don't it will hurt you.
 

DeletedUser667

Guest
the biggest problem (and i agree spies are a part of the game)..is not the information leaked, rather the lack of info you get when people start hiding their troop reports,cause they are spy paranoid...example: player A gets a spy report(from his cave) shows an easy win..when he lands he is defeated..he assumes cause he posted spy report they loaded it (not that that player was online and got decent support) and he hides in his report what he sent (even though the defender already knows)..which allows the rest of us no clue what could be there...till we either, respy, send blind, or ask for a pm'd report..so the idea of a spy is more damaging in my opinion than the spy..as it slows internal info
 

DeletedUser12872

Guest
Lol gotta love using spies. Yeahhh, it can kind of be a dirty move but desperate times call for desperate measures right?
 

DeletedUser

Guest
Fair imo. I've dealt with it on both ends. All the big alliances do it at some point. Just part of the game.
 

DeletedUser

Guest
Hack Rancid said:
This is a war game. Spies are part of war. If you choose to handicap yourself and your alliance by not using them, that's your choice. But you can bet I'm gonna be looking at copies of your forums all the while that you are busy preserving your integrity.
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Lol pretty much how I feel.
 

DeletedUser

Guest
MissChievousPixie said:
Depends on your definition of spying and what type of info we're talking about.

I am a shamelss gossip so often find out things that happen behind closed doors in other alliances but I don't see that the same as using spies. It's nothing like getting info on who has cities claimed and CS arrival times. In many cases the stuff I find out aren't secrets anyways, I just find out sooner than they happen but it's nothing hidden as such. So things like merges being agreed and pacts being desolved, everyone will find out anyways so it's not an issue if I find out a bit sooner but occasionally it gives a bit of heads up. If its something that will effect diplomacy for my alliance so like knowing sooner.
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I am the same way...!! Dont get me wrong...farming, attacking and defending is a great part of the game... but I gain more satisfaction from being in-the-know and talking with the other players.. and being able to make decisions before others based on this knowledge is huge..
But being someone that has been accused of being a spy and that my conversating has backfired on.. I can tell you that the game is now a little less fun... I enjoyed knowing things that other didnt.. but when conversations get spread around that's when I went from a friendly busybody to a super spy..LOL.. .

Keep in mind im still so new to this game that i will be called a noob for some time still... So the outcome of this was completely my own noob fault.. (but im sure there are ways to have my cake and eat it too)

Mofo82 said:
The part about them joining is the most valid argument anyone can give against spies, and the hardest one to argue with. Typically, I decide if a spy can join my alliance based on the motive they had for spying in the first place. If it was something like they were afraid of being conquered, no, they are not allowed to join. If it was because they had a friend in my alliance, maybe. You just have to make a decision, are you willing to take that chance? I've got a few different strategies for catching spies, so usually I am (if it's a good player).
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Its like you guys are telling my story here.. LMAO..
Yes we all have friends. The longer you play the more likely you will run into them and speak to them.. even-though they are on a different team. And you might even help them from time to time...(aka be a spy)
But accepting a spy into your alliance doesnt always go well.. when other players find out that person was a "spy", even if it was just a friend helping a friend... the trust is still broken.. they no longer work with that player but keep important information secret and worry about every thing they say.. teamwork and communication are key to this game...without it you might as well play solo..

All the good intentions wont erase ppl's suspicions..


The Smilodon Fatalis said:
Most the time when I get info I either do a MM to the team or I strike up a conversation and it just comes out. My favorite phrase is "you're nothing like I thought". :D
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Lastly but not least.. my favorite response.... since i think he used this line on me....
When a leader of one of the largest alliances messages you and starts drumming up conversation.. its easy to forget who you are talking to.. and in smilo case he employs his Jedi mind tricks to pull information and actions right out of you..

Is a spy still a spy if they were tricked out of the information??? Or does that just make them a complete noob???????
 

DeletedUser4878

Guest
this is a war game and spying is part of war.

i just don't like when people go low enough to go on VM and get on another account to join an alliance and spy. how did that go for you stink eye? i did like the compliments in your message to your alliance about us though.
 

DeletedUser

Guest
Mofo82 said:
There's two things in Grep that put you at the top of a world: gold, and being extremely active.
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There is probably about 50 very active, gold heavy players at every world start. Only the best of those players can compete for the #1 spot. So, I disagree. You need those advantages but you also need to have the mentality and skill to beat every other player that also has those advantages.

Spying, turning enemy alliances against each other and other diplomacy tricks you can play is acceptable and part of the skill needed to win but IMHO you shouldn't abuse it. Relying on spies will backfire sooner or later, and lets be honest, it's just plain mean.

So to conclude:
Spying to gain a small advantage? Yes, sure.
Spying to totally destroy another player's game? No.
 
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