Bringing Back Upsilon: Updated Top 12 Sink or Swim

Oliver Clothesoff

Hekatonarch
If I may interject in this most formidable dialogue, I have a most humble request; humble in the sense that I am not in The Hive...

Sir Oliver, I would ask that in creating your next list,that you not overlook certain inaccuracies; mainly when you are determining Alliance ABP and DBP. To elaborate, what I mean is: previously you have alluded that my alliances ABP and DBP were substandard. What you must realize is that when a 'new' alliance is born, their BP starts at ZERO, even though the players may each individually have 100,000+. This is easily shown by adding up my Top 10 players Total BP and then looking at my Alliances Total BP. My top 10 players' individual BPexceeds that of the whole alliance.

I ask this NOT to be offensive, as I have enjoyed reading your lists from time to time, but in an effort to ensure that what I am reading is as accurate as possible.

Thank you for your time. I am lookiing forward to reading your 'revised' list. :)

It is taking longer than usual because my RL got a little busy.. should be another day.. I will do a legit analysis dont worry. I plan on breaking it down to the player level so as to make it clearer.
 

Garydam

Guest
And regardless if your sensibilities have been offended, the world forums have been way more exciting with our back and forth than the month before we probably had 3 posts to talk about...
Couldn't agree more, you can't beat a bit of banter. :cool:
 

Oliver Clothesoff

Hekatonarch
Ok.. worked on this some, and will update it with some screenshots as proof because some of the things I have seen are ridiculous, and even I wouldnt believe me just based on this post. That being said... hereeeee we go.

1. Assassins Rite
Last Rank: 3
Float then Sink
Starting with a bang.. this is also going to be my most in depth analysis because most of you on here are either delusional or in this alliance.. or both. But sorry new top dogs on Upsilon, I am still not impressed. Everything I have said in my previous post still stands, except now that based on your newer, higher point total, your statistics(while higher) are even less impressive. Will say as an alliance they are #2 in ABP, #9 in DBP and #2 in overall BP (still 2.7 million points from the top spot). That really says more on the other alliances than yourselves though, so lets look at it on an individual level. At this point in time You are 3rd in average player point rankings behind The Hive and Antimatter, but are closing the gap on 2nd place. You also have 2 players in the top 10 in total points and 13 players in the top 50. However, individual BP statistics paint a different picture. You only have 8 of the top 50 attackers in the world and one in the top 10 (nice King Codeine). Their top 2 players, including #1 in the world, Great Infidel and foos are #34 and #73 respectively. Now how do two players like that get in the top 10 w/o being top attackers? Simple, weak opponents, internals, and inactives. So to say the Hive only prey on the weak is a great example of a pot calling a kettle black. Lets check some stats:

foos:


Thats 3 cities from a Top 10 alliance which isnt bad, the 2 from The Hive are in O66 and the poor play that ocean has been discussed ad nauseum. What stands out even further is out of the last 10 cities taken, 5 are inactive, one was a loner and another is from an alliance that is ranked #40.

Dont worry your defense stats are worse. Assassins Rite has 2 players in the top 100 in DBP. #98 and #100.. and their highest ranked player in this stat is being internalized as we speak due to inactivity. Hence the spike in DBP. Their top players Great Infidel and foos are #264 and #478 respectively




Way to help out your alliance guys :-(. Olympic Games FTW

With all that, Assassins Rite has 3 of the top 50 fighters in the world. Their top player is again the inactive currently being internalized. (One of the others is King Codeine. Congrats again)

So how did an alliance like this come to be #1 in the world? Simple, in a 3 day span they took on 37 new players while dumping 32:



And that is all that would fit on the screen lol

So yes, you guys are floaters (aside from King Codeine) That havent had any real challenge in the world because you have united with all players close to you in a common hatred towards the Hive. While this was a nice job in recruiting from a PR standpoint, it is not enough to win you this world.
Also note that just because I call out other players on their statistics, it does not mean I think im the best player in the world. However I am not the top player or leader for my alliance. As a whole we do a much better job speaking for ourselves.

2. The Hive
Last Rank: 1
Swim
Nothing has changed. My alliance so wont say much. 5 of top 10 attackers, 5 of top 10 defenders, 6 of top 10 fighters. #1 in ABP, DBP, and Total BP by a wide margin. Sank many of the alliances on my prior list.Let it also be noted that they are at war with 4 of the top 10 alliances, not counting Assassins Rite. Where are the weak targets may I ask?

3. Havoc - Black Ops
Last Rank: 5
Float
Previously Havoc 25, I thought this alliance would merge into the other alliances, but it turns out This is the top alliance of their conglomerate. This is the place for their top players while their other 4 academies are based on location. With these guys activity is what will hurt them. Although this is their top alliance, it is still full of inactives and simmers. Group participation in OPs is low and And only 3-4 players can carry their weight as shown b the fact that they only have 5 players in the top 50 fighters. They are getting hammered in the north by The Elder Gods, but are making a strong push in the SW against Arrivederci. They are very spread out which could cause a divide in the long run, but they have their other alliances to connect them. Good communication is key for these guys.

4. The Trinity
Last Rank: 6
Sink
When this alliance first came together I thought the showed good promise. They are now getting hammered by the Hive as they took on some of the better players from the alliances previously sunk by the Hive. Their Academy is also in the same situation. No need for further detail, nothing much has changed from my previous post except now they are being targeted more.

5. The Elder Gods
Last Rank: 7
Swim
I must say this alliance has turned it around. Through decent recruiting and high activity this alliance has been able to take advantage of Havoc in "their" core oceans. It seems their goal is to expand away from the core as they are avoiding another conflict with The Hive. How long it will last remains to be see, as there is still a lot left to be established in this section of the world.

6. The Oracle
Last Rank: N/R
Float
This alliance has made their way into the top 10 by picking up some of the left overs in their alliance from Jury of Destruction and Immortals. While this occurred almost 2 months ago, this alliance has not shown any urge to increase beyond their current position. They have aligned themselves with all others against the Hive and they are directly within a peaceful area. This is shown by the fact that they only have 1 player in the top 50 DBP and only 4 of the top 100 fighters. They do have 3 of the top 25 attackers, but their top player, lord squid, preys on the weak. They havent really been tested, and currently only have 1 top 20 alliance in which they are fighting with. Only time will tell what becomes of this alliance, but it is likely they will be hit by one of the top 10 alliances looking to expand somewhere other than the core. Also.. please stop sending support 5 or 6 oceans away. Every time a city is taken in the core oceans there is support coming that would miss RR completely.

7. Antimatter
Last Rank: N/R
Float then Sink
This alliance was formed after my last ranking as a response to other alliances beginning to feel the pressure from The Hive. Picking up where Immortal players left off, this alliance also took in some top players from alliances like Arrivederci. The goal was to form a super alliance to battle The Hive in the south. What this has turned into has been hitting Hive inactives and turtling up. This alliance still works well with the alliances from which their members originally came, but nothing else has changed. They are trying to gain a presence in the core oceans by sneaking their way in, however their top players continue to get hit hard. The nice part is that this alliance as 2 others that continue to support them while they attempt to go on the offensive. While many threats have been spewed, little action has been taken as shown by them only have 4 players in the top 50 attackers.

8. Arrivederci
Last Rank: 9
Float then Sink
Nothing has really changed for this alliance except for the fact that they lost some of their better players to antimatter. This alliance would be better off called Antimatter Defenders. They have 5 players in the top 50 defenders, and most support goes to protect their leader and the antimatter cities in O45. they only have 2 players in the top 100 attackers so this alliance has turned to Sim City. They arent being threatened in their core, but that is constantly changing as their enemies grow around them.

9. Havoc - House of Orange
Last Rank: N/R
Sink
To be honest I have no idea which Havoc this originally was. This is another northern section for Havoc, and I'm assuming their second in command. Eventually I see these top players merging into Havoc - Black Ops to better fight The Elder Gods up north. But for now this alliance has 3 top 100 attackers and 2 top 100 defenders resulting in 2 top 100 fighters. As with most of havoc's secondary alliances, activity is an issue and even possessing some of these players are just a ploy to boast points. (Which most of you know I am NOT a fan of)

10. Imperial Cult
Last Rank: 12
Float
This alliance has gone no where in since my last rankings They continue to sim and take advantage of their allegiances. No top 100 attackers or defenders. This alliance is merely existing unbothered as all nearby alliances have decided to not attack them as they are all shooting for The Hive.

Based on the fact that Imperial Cult can exist in the top 10 alliances in this world, I dont even see a point in discussing #11 or #12
 

Oliver Clothesoff

Hekatonarch
Shorter: "AR members should be defending cities against non-existent attacks, but The Hive can't be bothered to defend its members in an entire ocean" :D
The Hive has almost 3 times as much DBP than and other alliance.. More DBP then #2-4 combined.. I swear.. does anyone use statistics to back their outlandish comments??



AR doesnt have much DBP because they befriend everyone around them. I said that too.. But thanks for trying..

If I am going to put effort into making my statements, the least you could do is do the same.. Else there is no need for me to respond to them.
 
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Zuul

Guest
Oliver, I love the effort you put into the top 10, it was a very enjoyable read even if biased by your presence in The Hive. That being said, what was outlandish about my comment? How does The Hive's DBP numbers refute anything I said? :s
 

Oliver Clothesoff

Hekatonarch
That The Hive cant be bothered to defend members in an entire ocean.. obviously incorrect considering we have more DBP than some alliances that cover 8+ oceans while we really only cover 4. Saying we cant be bothered couldnt be further from the truth. The numbers show we go above and beyond defending our guys.

Also please let me know where I am being biased. I try not to let where I stand affect my analysis of each alliance. That is why i dont say much about The Hive. The only reason I went into such detail on an alliance level and individual level for AR is to show that I am NOT being biased. What alliance I am in doesnt change what the numbers show. Now do I put a little bit of sarcasm into it and maybe, dare I say it, rudeness into my analysis of AR? Sure. But thats part of the fun of the externals, and obviously it has helped liven the place back up. I dont have to say that AR members are oblivious to the truth or that for an alliance almost 8 million points in size their war numbers "suck". But really they are that poor. I just emphasize with attitude lmao.
 

Zuul

Guest
That The Hive cant be bothered to defend members in an entire ocean.. obviously incorrect considering we have more DBP than some alliances that cover 8+ oceans while we really only cover 4. Saying we cant be bothered couldnt be further from the truth. The numbers show we go above and beyond defending our guys.
I apologize for my comment then, it must have been some other incorrect Hive member that said that. So, since we have established that The Hive goes to the mattress for every city in every ocean, how about AR being 49-0 against The Hive in the past 60 days? Not bad for an alliance that only preys on the weak!

Also please let me know where I am being biased. I try not to let where I stand affect my analysis of each alliance....I dont have to say that AR members are oblivious to the truth or that for an alliance almost 8 million points in size their war numbers "suck". But really they are that poor. I just emphasize with attitude lmao.
You didn't take into account anything from The Cathar Empire's point on BP: that is doesn't transfer. Thus, older alliances will always have more BP. Thus, the stat doesn't mean much.
 

Digtal.Native

Guest
so you guys really think AR poses a real challenge to The Hive? then why is AR staying out of our core oceans? why do they only attack the members that are the hardest for us to defend? lets be realistic here... when a city in ocean 66 is revolted and reported right away, about 85-90% of our alliance cant get support there in less than 20-30 hours. so yes we have lost cities in that ocean... but then again we planned for that and knew that was going to happen.

as for why we are not taking AR cities, its simple. CS's cant travel more than 48 hours away. we simply cant get there because the game mechanics do not allow it. my questions to AR's leadership is: how come you guys have NEVER gone to war with any alliance of similar size in your own oceans? and why do you keep using The Trinity as your buffer against us? the poor guys are getting destroyed over here while you guys feed them the lies that they have no choice but to fight us...
 

DudeRanch

Citizen
I apologize for my comment then, it must have been some other incorrect Hive member that said that. So, since we have established that The Hive goes to the mattress for every city in every ocean, how about AR being 49-0 against The Hive in the past 60 days? Not bad for an alliance that only preys on the weak!


You didn't take into account anything from The Cathar Empire's point on BP: that is doesn't transfer. Thus, older alliances will always have more BP. Thus, the stat doesn't mean much.

You attacked the refugees from a small O66 alliance that collapsed. We took them in to give them a chance to accumulate some BP and move to our core oceans. I have said this before and I will say it again: If you consider yourself to be all that and a bag of chips, please get to the Upsilon core faster :) Also, don't give me any of this nonsense about how we should come to you. WE are at the CORE of Upsilon, YOU are on the Rim. Can't wait to see you get here thisisgrepolis

As for alliance BP not carrying over to a new alliance, you are correct. In this case, I encourage you to sit back and peruse your members stats (those DO stay with the member no mater how many times he/she hops to a new alliance). Speaking of that, are you guys playing music in TeamSpeak and just landing in whatever random alliance is available when the music stops?
 
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Cerulias

Guest
OC what are you doing man?!! That is too much information, King of Griping might be able to gain some "secret" insights or knowledge about The Hive...lmao

Oh no they might learn too much about us and take advantage of it...lol First off, if your alliance is any good, any information that was shared in a top 12 should be common knowledge. Is that why ASS is too scared to do their own write up? They think we haven't done our homework on them hence their fear in "sharing" too much but what they don't know is we seem to know more about them than their own alliance members.

Great write up, like usual. You know if you ASS guys hate our analysis so much, instead of complaining about someone trying to entertain us with a few hours of work why doesn't King Clown or whomever write up their own analysis and show us the error of our way...thisisgrepolis
 

Zuul

Guest
You attacked the refugees from a small O66 alliance that collapsed.
First post:
2. Uprising
Swim
Outside of The Hive, these guys have the highest per player average of any of the other Top 12 alliances. They are a rim based alliance, so they have a stronghold on their core and cover a large area of the map...Their Top 5 status in ABP and DBP also show strong participation from the top down.
:)
 

Oliver Clothesoff

Hekatonarch
I apologize for my comment then, it must have been some other incorrect Hive member that said that. So, since we have established that The Hive goes to the mattress for every city in every ocean, how about AR being 49-0 against The Hive in the past 60 days? Not bad for an alliance that only preys on the weak!
Like I said.. been discussed ad nauseum. As you can see from my colleagues remarks O66 was us taking in refugees and getting them into our core. some players went inactives, others gave up on their O66 cities for open slots to take red cities close to the rest of us. However, I understand that this is the ONLY claim to fame AR has in this world so please by all means keep bringing it up over and over again.


You didn't take into account anything from The Cathar Empire's point on BP: that is doesn't transfer. Thus, older alliances will always have more BP. Thus, the stat doesn't mean much.
And you couldnt be any more wrong.. AGAIN. I too everything from Cathar's point into consideration. Please re-read my write up.. All my analysis is now based on individual statistics. As it stands, you alliances a 2 of the top 100 defenders in the world.. TWO. The higher of which had 24k DBP yesterday because he is being internalized. A player you added a month ago already went inactive. It doesnt matter if BP carried over because if you add 0 to 0 you still have 0.. When I get home I am going to add up all your members BP and give you AR's true count and then compare it to The Hives.. Maybe that will drive home the point.

And in regards to Uprising.. no one (other than DR smh) said the alliance was small... the group that didnt want to join AR was.. c'mon use some logic..

Also.. if you want your stats to count.. quit merging and recruiting like an MRA.
 
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DudeRanch

Citizen
First post:


:)
As I said, you attacked their refugees AFTER the alliance collapsed. I did not say you attacked "Uprising". Even our closest O55 cities had incredibly long TT's and therefore could not be very effective in defending O66 cities, as almost every one of them were located in South O66.

At any rate, please continue patting yourself on the back. I truely hope it fuels you to not quitting upsilon as I DO look forward to having you and all other overly boisterous, self-proclaimed "professionals", on our borders as soon as possible, leveling up my cities for me :)
 

legendary.xm

Guest
my questions to AR's leadership is: how come you guys have NEVER gone to war with any alliance of similar size in your own oceans? and why do you keep using The Trinity as your buffer against us? the poor guys are getting destroyed over here while you guys feed them the lies that they have no choice but to fight us...
Little hypocritical, no? Or are you hoping everyone forgot that your alliance merged w/ Dulce instead of fighting them? Oh, and good job with 'destroying' Trinity. Is that why you asked them for an NAP? And you call us cowards, lol.

Once again, more and more idiotic propaganda that doesn't reflect what's happening in game. It's really unfortunate as some of your members seem like really decent people. Yet you've fed your members a bunch of crap, continue to do so, and now find yourselves with more enemies than you can count.

Look buddy, let me be frank here. The truth of the matter is your leadership(you included), is a failure. As I've said before and I'll reiterate again, short-term planning with long-term hopes=failure. That's why you're in the boat you're in. Forced to beg other alliances to break their existing pacts, forced to beg other alliances for an NAP, messaging our members to change ranks, etc. Yikes. And now you're having to use Imperial and Oceans as a stop gap. Good luck with that.



PS: If you need some advice or pointers, feel free to send foos or myself an in-game PM. We'll be more than happy to hold your hand.
 

Zuul

Guest
[It's outlandish to say that] The Hive cant be bothered to defend members in an entire ocean.. obviously incorrect
Like I said.. been discussed ad nauseum. As you can see from my colleagues remarks O66 was us taking in refugees and getting them into our core. some players went inactives, others gave up on their O66 cities for open slots to take red cities close to the rest of us.
I'm so confused!



The fact is your taking in members from the Trinity that have been beaten away from one alliance or the other running away from The Hive. Not exactly the greatest strategy taking in refugees of our wars since they weren't able to save their other alliances the story will continue to repeat itself.
You attacked the refugees from a small O66 alliance that collapsed. We took them in to give them a chance to accumulate some BP and move to our core oceans.
So confusing!
 

Zuul

Guest
I want to make clear that I don't think that AR is the best alliance in Upsilon; I think there are many good alliances. The Havoc group is biggest on total points. The Antimatter group is great too, and I've been impressed by smaller alliances like Spec Ops. The Hive has a number of good core members but is relatively tiny in terms of membership.
 

Cerulias

Guest
LMAO Legendary acting like his alliance is the role model is extremely laughable. Short term planning? That is why we have been around since the inception of this server and have been on the top for almost all of Upsilon existence. So the Alliance that has gone to the top through merging every alliance they can run into, now criticizing another alliance for a merge...not hypocritical at all. So let me guess when trying to score a point you don't mind calling us hypocrites even though you guys have done the same but to an even larger extent.

So you think we are running scared of fighting so many alliances even though that has been the case since almost the inception of this server and we are still kicking. While your people have been in one alliance incarnation or another, running into each other, scaring each other and forming one giant kumbaya circle so you can all be protected from The Hive.

Your alliance has such a shortsightedness that its almost mind boggling. Its a joke, the only sad part is how you actually think your people are impressive for doing so and you have no idea how to conduct any form of long-term planning by your current actions. Lets see how you entertain members several oceans away from any action but I guess simmers and people too scared to actually fight are happy being in an alliance that keeps them coddled from any front lines.

I actually feel bad for the friends I have in your alliance that they have no choice but to be in such a terribly ran boring alliance with a very short half-life. Its a good thing you have an academy alliance to keep filling in those ranks as you lose members to your awful leadership.

Again why don't you guys share your "insight" and knowledge to write up a top 12 analysis or are you afraid on how laughable your analysis will be since you guys can't tell a good alliance if it slapped you on the side of the face...Zuul you seem to be the only one with any brains in that alliance lol I feel for ya

** Actually I take that back, its not fair to generalize every member of your alliance by the stupidity shown by some of your people. Obviously you have good players but every time Legendary opens his mouth it just makes the rest look awful.
 
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