DeletedUser5524
Guest
Can you define spam for me?
DeletedUser10254
Guest
Players really quit or leave servers early because they don't think spam battles are fun.
It would be interesting to learn the other side of the story from someone like you who uses spam every day as main strategy to take cities and to see how could you cope with a world where spam attacks are limited... I hope we get the chance
i feel you are mad we killed 45k dlu of you guys today and you are still yet to take a city from me like i did you
DeletedUser10254
Guest
constant attacks that are pointless, you know what spam is
DeletedUser1048
Guest
I don't see what relevance it has whether morg spams or not. This thread she posted is to fix spam. Also just because you do something doesn't mean you enjoy it or that it's your preferred way to play.
I've seen some good ideas and think what one person said before about having the alliances enforce a no spamming rule is probably the best way. Well technically removing the attack alarm would be the absolute best way to stop spam but I doubt most people would like that
I've seen some good ideas and think what one person said before about having the alliances enforce a no spamming rule is probably the best way. Well technically removing the attack alarm would be the absolute best way to stop spam but I doubt most people would like that
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DeletedUser5524
Guest
Well no thats where you are wrong. Hourly HC's can be considered spam but to me that is not what I would consider spam. This is why I was asking what you defined spam as.
DeletedUser10254
Guest
thats not spam i do that all the time
DeletedUser15919
Guest
This was an alternative definition that just came up actively in our Skype for Dyme:
"Spam is the intentional use of multiple actions taken by a single/multiple players (in Grepolis, 5 or more attacks/spies/trades from a single point, cancelled within 5-15 seconds of initiation to generate a command movement, cancel & reissue same act again over & over for a period longer than 5 minutes." (in this case the player received it from 3 alliances of the same affiliation, 51 unique members, for 76 hours straight) It also didn't work in this case as the player obviously is still playing ^^
Sending out dozens to hundreds of attacks/movements to create command entries only to cancel them & repeat them over extended periods of time to dishearten & intentionally cause a player to quit - THAT is not playing a game. In many other games & places outside of gaming, this has been defined as bullying/harassment & some places have legal implications in place for the behavior.
Not suggesting a course of action because, I do not OWN the GAME nor have authority to implement them. Just offering information for consumption.
Selectron
Citizen
That is a very good perspective on this issue - because sometimes bullying/harassment is the intention of the spammer. It should be added to §4) Code of Conduct for Grepolis.
It looks like my obsessive spammer is on VM. It's always funny when the bully runs away when he gets the same treatment back at him. lol
I'm curious what @gorsh.daddy has to say about this spamming issue, since it was a big part of his platform when running for Player Council.
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DeletedUser13931
Guest
Welcome to Grepolis....a WAR GAME. If you do not like getting attacked, play something else.
DeletedUser15920
Guest
That's exactly what we are doing - and I have to say that overall quitting grep was one of the better decisions I have ever made, no one wants to spend time dealing with dumb attacks completely un-rewarding for the time you have to put in and anti-fun. There are a variety of other gaming options available that do not interfere with players actual day to day lives.
DeletedUser15522
Guest
It's quite nice to be away from measuring the gold fights, and the intent to drive people away from the game. Free from the ankle monitor!
.......and still playin' war games with our buddies. Just not giving the money to Inno any longer. FREEEEDOOOOOOOOOOM!
.......and still playin' war games with our buddies. Just not giving the money to Inno any longer. FREEEEDOOOOOOOOOOM!
DeletedUser15919
Guest
Good news Everyone - we decided to take your sage advice & quit the game because we could not enjoy a game of war when the antagonist acts like a pathetic, small, little child that throws a tantrum when playing a game of war, gets attacked & responds with thousands of small spam attacks laced with unlimited gold units just to annoy someone over the course of nine days straight, all because you got distracted by Pandora's Box....
"I dream of a world where everyone quits & Jcoo has to play with himself." From the war journals of Mauler
DeletedUser5524
Guest
No it would be Jcoo VS the 100s of Maul Accounts tbh.
Serious note, spam is a serious problem but like this whole thread is dedicated to finding out what is actually spam is what matters. Some people get attacked 100 times during an OP and start crying "Spam Spam Spam" but thats not what it is at all..
DeletedUser4951
Guest
I'll use my experience as a leader against your alliance from En107.
Definition: Being locked out of the computer or being unable to sleep or continuing to poke with no CS despite the player being obviously on.
A good example of this was that Quizas guy from your alliance in EN107 trying to spam Sitthisoneout from mine. Or Silver Eyed Lion King trying to spam anyone that attacks him then going to publicly brag about it.
None of these tactics are necessary. Less good teams just use them in hopes that better teams will drop off in activity. Up till this point we didn't really organize any spam on people and shut down attempts to do so. Such things often yield negative results. Especially when leaders ignore them or try to justify them.
A good example of spam backfiring would be 107 again where now your front line vs us is mostly SELK, Pictureplan, and a bunch of people who have have their alarms off or are completely VMed because BS kicked off a spam war vs BWN. Oznob even tried to come to you to talk about it and Adam the Ruthless even heard Quizas out when Quizas realized he made a YUGE mistake. We all know that's a lot nicer and more patience than anyone would get from me in that scenario, yet it was still taken advantage of and nothing was done, heck one player of yours even had a list of people he had spammed off the world and still got to stay in BS.
So here's my question back. How do you plan to stop spam when you appear to actively encourage it and have players bragging in the forums about it? Who are you to even talk?
Definition: Being locked out of the computer or being unable to sleep or continuing to poke with no CS despite the player being obviously on.
A good example of this was that Quizas guy from your alliance in EN107 trying to spam Sitthisoneout from mine. Or Silver Eyed Lion King trying to spam anyone that attacks him then going to publicly brag about it.
None of these tactics are necessary. Less good teams just use them in hopes that better teams will drop off in activity. Up till this point we didn't really organize any spam on people and shut down attempts to do so. Such things often yield negative results. Especially when leaders ignore them or try to justify them.
A good example of spam backfiring would be 107 again where now your front line vs us is mostly SELK, Pictureplan, and a bunch of people who have have their alarms off or are completely VMed because BS kicked off a spam war vs BWN. Oznob even tried to come to you to talk about it and Adam the Ruthless even heard Quizas out when Quizas realized he made a YUGE mistake. We all know that's a lot nicer and more patience than anyone would get from me in that scenario, yet it was still taken advantage of and nothing was done, heck one player of yours even had a list of people he had spammed off the world and still got to stay in BS.
So here's my question back. How do you plan to stop spam when you appear to actively encourage it and have players bragging in the forums about it? Who are you to even talk?
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DeletedUser4460
Guest
I don't encourage spam under any circumstances, please don't use any of these discussion threads as PnP - it totally undermines the seriousity of the issues, so far everyone understood that... I always ask my team mates not to respond with spam to spam, as leader of opponent alliance it is for sure hard to imagine for you, but try it once.
As for spam attacks that in fact block someone out of the game those are punishable as far as I know, so all you need to do is submit a ticket.
Just 2 days ago on German market there was an incident in this topic. An alliance argued that they lost a wonder city due to the target player couldn't login because of continuous spam (not 100% sure that is exactly what happened). Support first reverted the conquest and banned the spammers. But this is not the end of the story, later they apologized for the bad decision, lifted bans and changed the owner of the WW city again, therefore the WW city was lost.
Without having actual knowledge of what really happened, what Support might have seen with their tools first and noticed later... can only assume one thing for sure: spam issue divides even Support team. German CM asked players on DE market to continue discussions about spam.
Spam seems to be less widespread issue on some of the markets, more problematic on worlds that are new, fast and don't have night bonus, that leads to different opinions - more are worried about the limitations of regular game than the effects of spam itself. It is still an open topic in GPC, but none of the suggestions got enough support yet that we could propose any as community request.
As for spam attacks that in fact block someone out of the game those are punishable as far as I know, so all you need to do is submit a ticket.
Just 2 days ago on German market there was an incident in this topic. An alliance argued that they lost a wonder city due to the target player couldn't login because of continuous spam (not 100% sure that is exactly what happened). Support first reverted the conquest and banned the spammers. But this is not the end of the story, later they apologized for the bad decision, lifted bans and changed the owner of the WW city again, therefore the WW city was lost.
Without having actual knowledge of what really happened, what Support might have seen with their tools first and noticed later... can only assume one thing for sure: spam issue divides even Support team. German CM asked players on DE market to continue discussions about spam.
Spam seems to be less widespread issue on some of the markets, more problematic on worlds that are new, fast and don't have night bonus, that leads to different opinions - more are worried about the limitations of regular game than the effects of spam itself. It is still an open topic in GPC, but none of the suggestions got enough support yet that we could propose any as community request.
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DeletedUser13931
Guest
Who are you on Dyme? Let me go out on a limb and state your alliance fabricates a ton of stuff. Who sends 1000’s of small attacks? I’m thinking you have a penchant for completely fabricating whatever you or your alliance needs to assuage your hurt feelings on quitting the server. It’s a war game, attack back. Oh wait...that was the problem with CH, you all very rarely attacked us in BoB.
DeletedUser13931
Guest
If it is a case of one player just attacking another player, let them fight it out. If it’s numerous players attacking a single player, then that player is being OP’d. Now if this goes on for a few days or so, then alliances will classify all the attacks, even the prior ones, as pure spam. Point of fact, most players don’t like to be attacked. So attack them and see what their alliance does. Does their alliance send them LTS? Do they move that player? It’s how you fight a war. Some here need to study some history and then come back and write these missives on the unfairness of whatever.
DeletedUser4951
Guest
I'm not using it as a PNP. We both know i could pile on a lot worse than I am. I'm outright saying that you're knowingly allowing spamming to go on in your alliance. In fact, in some instances where players left, they were told they would be spammed as punishment. Sometimes by leaders such as with TLC.
You were even told as such when one of your players started on us. Nothing was done until we decided to do something about it.
So pardon my skeptism here, but I'm questioning why we should listen? I mean from my POV, this seems like it's an issue to you because you started spamming charlie and that didn't work out for most the world. Then you tried with us and that's also not working. So now you want an attack limit or something.
I think it's a fair question considering skimming the comments makes me feel like I'm watching people raise their hands if they've been picked on by Regina George.
You were even told as such when one of your players started on us. Nothing was done until we decided to do something about it.
So pardon my skeptism here, but I'm questioning why we should listen? I mean from my POV, this seems like it's an issue to you because you started spamming charlie and that didn't work out for most the world. Then you tried with us and that's also not working. So now you want an attack limit or something.
I think it's a fair question considering skimming the comments makes me feel like I'm watching people raise their hands if they've been picked on by Regina George.
DeletedUser4460
Guest
I applied to Player Council because I believed spam can be in fault for most issues in the game: performance, players burn out few months after server start + loss of casual players + vacation mode for hiding then never return = dead world syndrome, disappearance of true battles and the missing humanity: too high activity required, alarm should be a tool for protection instead it is allowed to spam = weaponize alarm. Game and RL can not be compatible until spam on this unlimited level is allowed. We play the game less for fun, team spirit more for schadenfreude. This opportunity gave me chance to learn more all about these problems through players feedback and interaction with players from other markets. These general discussions help to collect or propose better suggestions.
Players who leave and join the opponents can experience increased number of attacks and call it spam /TLC/. Simply the number of frontline cities can trigger too much interest and put players in a situation when they get too many attacks, too many HCs.... it doesn’t even have to be an organized OP to be annoying /Charlie/, then the targeted players might return these attacks and become spammers... a vicious circle. Who started? No one knows. An alliance can not know how many attacks they sent total. I advise my team mates to only take as many frontline cities as they can handle or if the pressure is too high help them (defense, city swaps).
Leaders' power is limited, since the game allows most type of spams and we don’t have tools to prove spam really happened other than what is shared with us. Kick a player based on hearsay? Am I a bad leader if I don’t?
Last time I got proof of spam that report showed less than 10 attacks to different cities - is that spam? I thought it was not...
Unfortunately spam is an abused word and subjective (because the game doesn’t have rules or limits that would clarify what is unwanted). If I had proof that any of my team mates repeatedly abused these missing / unwritten limits I would intervene, but just because my opponents claim spam without facts I won’t. Many leaders won't take any actions because it is not forbidden.
We are all part of this problem, but I think community and leaders can not change the way Grepolis is played because we adapt to the game changes and what is possible, actually I don’t believe Support team could change anything even if there was a rule against spam. Spam is a bad tradition now, beginners can learn the game like this: spam someone until they turn off alarm then take any city you want. So yeah I think there should be a limit. We are brainstorming here because more players experience this as a problem.
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DeletedUser15919
Guest
Before your SPAM exploded across Dyme, I have had experience with you on several servers in different lives. It's sorta funny how so many people all come out & present the EXACT same situation with certain named players & those named players go to great lengths to assure themselves that it is the community & not them that are in the wrong. This is not an issue of requiring you to admit fault - you have already been caught & well documented. We are just providing proven & factual accounts as examples requested by the thread.
AS for Dyme, I was previously upon the server with the 14th founded city in the crossroads of 44/54/45/55, weeks prior to your arrival there. At one point I was a top 20 world attacker & defender along with several other known strong community players. Life was good as 44 developed & alliances fell. Sadly, the now well documented incident also soured my desire to continue in the environment.
In direct response to your inquiry on "Who sends 1000's of small attacks" You are known as "The Golden Boy" by many because you drop gold so heavily, even Mauler is intimidated with the volume. However, you are also known by another Nickname "He who launches no CS". There is of course a way to confirm this built into the game - the award system does capture a date. But, I'm sure you already know this.
Funny that you do not know me, whenever I needed slots all I needed was poke you once & you happily provided. Someone sends 1 attack as a harbor check & you retaliate with 36-72 hours of nonstop reprisals of 1000's of attacks large & small, across all the player's cities, no matter the ocean. You were much more generous than Mauler, TheCelt, --attackme-- or the other departed namechanger heavyweights. You could gold up dozens of full pop nukes from the same city in a matter of minutes, but never send a CS (Fireships loved your ls btw - best ratio's ever!)
I have witnessed the live siege feeds & command cues - unless there is a phantom JCOO (same exact name) playing on Dyme, in BOB, with cities in 54, that is one of the known biggest community whales, you are the same Jcoo that hid behind morale on Nicea. Enjoy the community you built.
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This said - you can easily program a change into the game to compensate for those that "shoot more blanks than bullets" by implementing a diminishing return. If you can already offer analysis in events or battle camps for a failure of an attack before you launch it, then the programming does already exist. It is more a matter of will power in changing how the game is played & how the remaining community would react to the change. With so many driven out, would meaningful numbers return? That is for the foreign owners of this game to determine.